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GTS OWNERS CLUB
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elementalist
Inspector
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 287
Location: Essex, innit
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 Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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Oo and while I've 'got you' Mr T, knowing you're a man with experience of quite a few different bikes/scooters, when you say the Fuoco is unresponsive or lacking feedback, where on a scale of all bikes are you meaning? Are we saying it's not as manoeuverable as a Bandit, but better than a Harley? Also, would you say it's more lumbering than other heavy bikes, like a goldwing, but that way because it's stable/safe, like a goldwing? Is it badly designed or just that way because of what it is?
(showing my noobness even more!)
I suppose what I'm saying is, if you were looking for a 'safe', comfortable but pretty capable scooter, would you consider the Fuoco?
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CheekyThomas
Guvernor
Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 1374
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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| elementalist wrote: | Oo do demos tend to be restricted?...
(showing my noobness here, innit?) |
Some do some dont, we had 2 demos... one restricted to 33 and one full power at 39bhp. Couldnt tell any difference to be honest... |
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CheekyThomas
Guvernor
Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 1374
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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| elementalist wrote: | Oo and while I've 'got you' Mr T, knowing you're a man with experience of quite a few different bikes/scooters, when you say the Fuoco is unresponsive or lacking feedback, where on a scale of all bikes are you meaning? Are we saying it's not as manoeuverable as a Bandit, but better than a Harley? Also, would you say it's more lumbering than other heavy bikes, like a goldwing, but that way because it's stable/safe, like a goldwing? Is it badly designed or just that way because of what it is?
(showing my noobness even more!)
I suppose what I'm saying is, if you were looking for a 'safe', comfortable but pretty capable scooter, would you consider the Fuoco? |
Its a weird situation with the 3 wheelers, they have loads of grip from the the front end, the problem is the lack of feedback from the tyre to the handlebars, theres too many bearings, pivots, ball joints and drop arms in the system that all act like shock absorbers leaving the rider with a numb feeling... normally handlebars are bolted directly to the forks which means you feel every twitch, skip, hop, judder from the tyre, which allows you to feel the road surface as it changes, so you can feel the grip level change, and know when your approaching the limit of grip before you get there, where as on the 3 wheelers you feel very little until the front end slides and think woah! Luckily, the extra grip the front end has means you tend to drift and not lowside like on 2 wheelers.... the numbness has nothing to do with manuverability, they move great!
And no there nothing like a goldwing or even worse a VL1500... them things are like trying to balance a car on 2 wheels... 
Yes if your wanting a safe comfortable scooter for day to day use then the fuoco is ideal... its the whole point of the machine to be honest. The MP3 400 is also well worth a look, if you like the looks of the MP3... performance difference is barely noticeable but you get more storage and better screen choices. |
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elementalist
Inspector
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 287
Location: Essex, innit
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for that. Makes me feel better about my three wheel choice  As long as I'm not losing manoeuverability I feel ok. As long as I learn to read the little amount of feedback I get 
| CheekyThomas wrote: | | The MP3 400 is also well worth a look, if you like the looks of the MP3... performance difference is barely noticeable but you get more storage and better screen choices. |
You surprise me there - the 400 and 500 are pretty much the same size and weight, so you'd think the 500 would be noticably different to the 400?
Fancy educating me on power scales?
250 to 400 = 60% increase
250 to 500 = 100% increase
400 to 500 = 25% increase
I guess this does look odd, coz it would seem that upgrading to the 500 instead of the 400 is almost twice the improvement, but the improvement from 400 to 500 is only a quarter
I used to like maths, me.... Now my brain's a bit sloooow.
As a matter of interest, are the numbers that simple? For instance, does a 250 feel like 'double' the power of a 125? Does a 1200 feel twice as powerful as a 600? Why does the 500 not perform appreciably (25%) better?
You should charge me for a training course!
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CheekyThomas
Guvernor
Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 1374
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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The difference from the 400 to 500 is very little... and i mean very little certainly not 25%.... maybe 10% max.
The 125 MP3 is the worst 125 ive ridden, it revs like a mad thing and goes nowhere, proper horrible thing to ride.... the 250 is good, very good, plenty of acceleration and nice and smooth... you only really notice the weight to engine size when it comes to motorways and overtaking.
When it comes to the 400 or 500 ignore engine size completely, it makes no difference... choose between them by the body styling.
Yes the 500 has a few more CCs and slightly more BHP but its also as aerodynamic as a shed with the door open.... this evens the performance out no-end, On the road they ride the same... you wont get off a MP3-400 and onto a Fuoco and think its quicker, trust me ive ridden PLENTY of both
And the power difference from a 250 to either the 400/500 models isnt 100% either, more like 40%.... initial lift off is better on the 250, the master engine judders a bit on lifting off, once moving the bigger engine has more torque so can change speed easier and quicker... so overtaking is much easier and safer... the bigger engines also have about another 15mph topspeed over the 250. |
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elementalist
Inspector
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 287
Location: Essex, innit
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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Hmm very interesting thanks lots for the great info (as always Mr T!).
The 400 is under the power limit for me too, innit? Could try one any time... hmm...
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CheekyThomas
Guvernor
Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 1374
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Thats a odd situation... its classed as learner legal but has an official 34 bhp |
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smudger
Guvernor
Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 1066
Location: The Wirral; the bit of land between the Mersey and the Dee
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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| CheekyThomas wrote: | | Thats a odd situation... its classed as learner legal but has an official 34 bhp |
Interesting point you raise there CT, is 33bhp at the crank or the rear wheel? Manufactures normally quote at the crank as far as I was aware, but at the rear wheel is usually a little less? 
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SPIKE
troop
Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 31
Location: Rugeley bypass, aka Fugly Test track
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:22 am Post subject: |
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Hi,im the mate of fleecemeister with the Fuoco. I had mine converted for a hundred quid to a legal trike so i can ride it on a car licence without a lid on  Yes it can twitch in the wet but its fun to drift  I get about 140 miles to a tank and cruise at 90 with passenger and luggage. I have no probs with keeping up or leading Fleece on his GTS ( he now curses his rev limiter) but when it comes to weaving in and out of city traffic the size and weight of the Fuoco is its downfall. Would i ever want to change it, yeah sure, when they make a 800cc version. Come on Gilera, bring it on!!!!!!!! |
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elementalist
Inspector
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 287
Location: Essex, innit
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| smudger wrote: | | CheekyThomas wrote: | | Thats a odd situation... its classed as learner legal but has an official 34 bhp |
Interesting point you raise there CT, is 33bhp at the crank or the rear wheel? Manufactures normally quote at the crank as far as I was aware, but at the rear wheel is usually a little less? |
Being a scoot noob I don't know for sure But in the spec it says 34bhp and 25kW. Being all decimalised these days the regulations are in centimetres. Maybe 1bhp gets lost in translation?
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Innocenti
Big Cheese
Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 1205
Location: Surrey Village
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:06 am Post subject: |
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 i also have toyed arounes thinking of getting the fuoco but i think i love the old mp3 so much i would prob get a 400 i love the extra space the MP3 has over the fuoco the slightlet better seat height, but all in all i still love it go's well (same journey for me to work bit of motorway and town), yea we came back from liege and we were a bit slower than the other by what 3mph !!! not like woooooooooo, and on they way ther i road with dave on his fuoco and all had was that bit more grunt when overtaking but then with the extra cc you would expect that,
so im thinking wait a bit and get a 400, but take one out and have a good old test drive i did,,,, before i got the 250 and that was only cost at the time because of the price new of the 400 and fuoco,,,,,, what ever you get will be worth it anyways
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elementalist
Inspector
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Posts: 287
Location: Essex, innit
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:41 am Post subject: |
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I suppose as long as I stick the the used market and buy wisely I could get a 400 when the weather is better this year and if that doesn't do the job, try a Fuoco in 2010.
All I really want is some overtaking power on the motorways and A roads - for everything else the MP3 is great.
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Roadcaptain
Sargeant
Joined: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 65
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| Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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What is the 'real' top end? about 95
How is the acceleration near the top end? good
Is the Fuoco as manoeuverable? I would say yes
How much quicker off the mark is it? a bit
Is it as/more stable? same I would say
How does the storage compare? not as good but still plenty
How does the mpg compare? about 90ish miles to a tank ( I ride fast)
Is there a mid (chest) height screen? yes
Does it use the same top-box as the MP3? don't know
What extras does it have? (stuff like a 'lighter' socket) light under seat,12v socket
What upgrades are needed? (stuff like horn, lights, rear hugger) rear hugger, lights are fantastic
What do you think of the silver one? not my bag
What haven't I thought about? seat is not the most comfortable but you get used to it |
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smudger
Guvernor
Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 1066
Location: The Wirral; the bit of land between the Mersey and the Dee
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| Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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I hate to admit this as I love my GTS but the Fugly is growing on me 
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GAVSKIN
Site Admin
Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 1128
Location: ON THE MIDNIGHT MEAT TRAIN
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| Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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 give your self a slap with a wet cod!!! dont do it smudge trust me
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